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Re: Media goes into full race batting mode.
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
You didn't answer the question.


You don't do anything special, but at the same time you don't sit around complaining about how people are afraid given the ONLY piece of information is that you belong to a group that is demonstrably more violent regardless of cause.

You attempt to find the cause and see if it can be brought into line.

You educate said group to understand the bad reputation they have and why it is EVERYONE's best interest to remediate this problem.

Posted on: Ystrday 11:00 am
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Re: Media goes into full race batting mode.
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
If true, what bearing would a past juvi record have on this instance?

Classic "blame the victim" campaign - sad.


Maybe a balancing of the picture given that he is the greatest guy in the world that his supporters would like you to believe. Not to drag in or resurrect the Trayvon Martin thing but the whole little kid picture kind of thing.

It also gives you information that may have been known by the policeman at the time. People don't operate in a vacuum. Had the policeman known that the kid was a problem his whole life and violent problems to boot would he be more likely to pull the trigger.....Yes in my opinion.

Posted on: Ystrday 10:51 am
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Re: New Podcast is up
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
There should be some kind of policy on here for solicitation.


There is....if one solicits they will come.....so here I go:

Open in new window

Any takers? Any? Hook'em?

Give a guy a break.

Posted on: 8/28 7:35 pm
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Re: Media goes into full race batting mode.
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
When you referred to it as an illusion.


WOW! That is a real stretch.

I referred to the illusion OR the promotion. How can you promote something that doesn't exist? Not every instance of black/white confrontation is racist. That is a fact. In these instances Sharpton and Jackson produce the illusion. In instances where there IS racism they along with their proponents and the white supremists on the other side PROMOTE it. I stated both. If you bothered to take my statement within ANY CONTEXT whatsoever of the conversation you would have seen that OVER AND OVER AND OVER I have referred to racism. I also stated that racism is worse in other countries. Racism being worse could mean none but most likely means some exist but more exists elsewhere.

Posted on: 8/28 4:14 pm
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Re: Business as Usual
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
I think the truly sad part about the pharmaceutical companies is the amount of money these organizations get from the government (Institute of Health) to cure these diseases and then to turn around and stick it to the taxpayers. Hopefully, Lichtenstein has a great budget for supporting these companies because they wouldn't get another penny from the US if I were in charge. We can build another company here to compete with them with government help.

Posted on: 8/28 3:59 pm
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Re: Media goes into full race batting mode.
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
If this is so, then people are very irrational. The likelihood of being killed by another person, especially a stranger, is very small, particularly if you are white and not a drug dealer. The "7.5 times greater" figure is insignificant because the base numbers are so small. It is like saying a raisin has 7.5 times more calories than a peanut, or vice versa. It is misusing or misunderstanding the data.


I think we have shown that on this site with Stanley's crazy protection of children from guns and the levels he wants to go through when a child is 10 to 100 times more likely to drown in their pool than be accidentally killed by a gun.

Finally something we agree on.

At the same time, people make many of the same mistakes with animals. Mosquitos are literally (<-yes used correctly) 1000 times more likely to kill you than a shark but I am pretty sure no one starts their 6 o'clock news out with a mosquito sighting.

The analogies are valid. Whether you like them or they are politically correct......

.....and congratulations on being so race neutral. You sir, are an outlier.

Posted on: 8/28 2:48 pm
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Re: Media goes into full race batting mode.
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
In any event, this discussion is getting far afield from the point I was making - that people have inherent biases based on race, sex, etc., in response to your argument that racism doesn't exist and it is a hoax created by black leaders.


Where on earth did I say racism doesn't exist? Is this the place where I get snitty like you and whine about my arguments being contorted? I think I stated there was racism in this quote.

Quote:
That is correct. At the same time, how many lootings and riots do you think we would have without racism? It is in the best interest of the media to promote racism. See below.

Do you deny that they aren't giving this coverage above and beyond its news value? I mean there was rioting and looting for a couple of nights and for the most part the subsequent rioting was done by out-of-towners am I right about that?

If we lived in racial harmony a significant number of events would be like the Utah kid and would be a non-story. What would fill the dead air then? Racism provides a viable news story during slow news periods between plane crashes, wars and elections. There is 24 hours 7 days a week of air time that needs to be filled and there is important needs to differentiate the coverage from the "mainstream" or those filthy "conservatives/liberals"


I have at NO POINT in time stated there is no racism. I merely stated it is in a LOT OF people's best interest to promote racism and not really in their best interest to eliminate it.

Posted on: 8/28 2:40 pm
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Re: Media goes into full race batting mode.
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
There are a lot of innate fears that we have moved past because of our intellect.


We are LESS unlike animals than you think we are.

Posted on: 8/28 1:05 pm
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Re: Media goes into full race batting mode.
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
What do you do about one group having a higher incident of homicide than another? What actions are acceptable to you and which do you think we should take?


Well, if we take your stance on guns as a proxy we should be able to do background checks on people any time they interact with other people as that is a potential place for homicide regardless how small. We should set up kiosks ALL over to do these checks and if the person has a criminal record shouldn't be allowed to interact with another person regardless of how long ago the criminal offense happened. You can never be too careful when it comes to life and death, you know.

Posted on: 8/28 10:28 am
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Re: Media goes into full race batting mode.
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
What does that bring us back to? To a large degree, past racism and to a lesser degree present racism.


First off, you will NEVER get rid of racism. It is as much a part of who we are as our 23 chromosomes. It is a VERY valuable tool that we have used to survive and for our ancestors to survive. Think about what happens when a lion eats Grog. The next lion we see if we were not predisposed to judging on looks we would meet the same demise as Grog. At the same time, tribal creatures like us HAD to recognize when a different tribe was approaching. The inability to do this had serious survival implications. Stereotyping is an inherent part of any animal that has had to survive a dangerous world. As a result any animal of practically any intelligence level has it. So the attempt to eliminate racism is a fool's errand.

The question is when is it useful and what to do with it. I recognize that I have a predisposition to eliminate interaction with people "not" like me. When I have hired I have gone out of my way to interact with the potential candidate to the point of making a first impression in a way that is NOT visual. As a result, I have made 3 decisions to hire and have hired 1 person of color. That, in my opinion is doing pretty good as that is 33% of the people I have hired in a business computer science/engineering that has a low representation of this ethnic group. The problem can be communications. The fact is that sometimes I could guess the ethnicity of the person simply from an email and I would disqualify this person from the running even though many, including those in my company, that would denigrate me from doing so. I am sorry but the use of proper grammar is important. I grew up in a hick holler in a coal mining town where none of us spoke proper English. I was able to learn it so can others and I try to do so now. I am not talking about small grammar mistakes, we all make them. I am talking about communicating with people that can not conjugate the verb to the proper tense or even be bothered to have subjects and verbs in their sentences. In most instances I have no idea of the race because I have not seen them nor have I seen their name (I make my secretary take names off of resumes because I don't want to be biased.) but I have my suspicions. You can't have that in a professional office. This can harm people's chance for advancement.

Posted on: 8/28 10:10 am
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Re: Media goes into full race batting mode.
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
You didn't answer the question.


There is no known answer to the question. It is an interesting question in its own right. At the same time I don't think it matters to the race discussion. I am sure it has a lot to do with socioeconomic issues. It is probable that they share these issues with all races and that once identified would greatly benefit race relations but until then, we have what we have.

One would suspect that blacks are not inherently bad people. That seems like too much of a cop out. It would be interesting to see if traits can be pinned down to certain racial genetics. I know that historically whites have been over the top with their killing and invention of new ways to inflict pain on others. I doubt that any research will be done in a timely enough manner to be relevant but it would, in my mind. be interesting to know. Is there a genetic predisposition based on race to a particular behavior.

The chances of getting any funding for this research is nill.

Posted on: 8/28 9:40 am
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Re: Media goes into full race batting mode.
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
It's clear that blacks have higher incidents of crime, but why is that? Are they just bad people or are there other factors?


The issue started with blacks are the VICTIMS of racism and that is a valid perspective of why things like Furgeson happen. A STATISTIC was used which showed that 51% of whites had unfavorable view or blacks as a backup for that argument. The point is that the 51% unfavorable view is NOT a "number in a vacuum" it is a number that has to some extent been earned. Once again, not saying that once you know a person better or know more about a person the racial issue becomes less of an issue. I think we have gone out of our way to help racism over the years. At some point there is diminishing returns to that. You can't change the underlying numbers. When we have a murder rate that is statistically consistent and a violent crime rate that is statistically consistent come talk about the numbers IF they are still biased.

EDIT: It wouldn't surprise me if the violent crimes/murder consistency would be solved if blacks would stop killing blacks ala Chicago/DC/Detroit. I don't know for a fact but that is a lot of the problem.

Posted on: 8/28 9:03 am
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Re: Media goes into full race batting mode.
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
So your hypothesis is that white bias against all blacks is justified because .024 % of blacks commit homicides?



Hmmmm....interesting that we are concerned about this stereotype and the numbers.

Here is a link to what I hope is a purely statistical site. I have no reason to believe that is an agenda. I am sure you probably will but the point is if you have a problem with the numbers refute them, don't just refuse to accept them.

http://wmbriggs.com/blog/?p=7168

You are 7.5 times more likely to be murdered by a black person than a white person assuming of course that you are a victim of homicide. That is a pretty serious number to have hanging over a particular race's head regardless of its relevance to a particular person's situation. I think that most people have this number in the back of their head. It DOES get reported along with the make-up of convicted criminals in which blacks are statistically OVER represented compared to whites when comparing violent criminals.

If I am walking down the street, and I am in a section of town which has high incidents of homicides and I see a black person I would be an idiot not to be at the very least more uneasy and more watchful. This is true whether I am white OR BLACK! My race matters not!

The same is true if I were walking down the same street in a bad section of town and I encountered a MALE. Male's are more likely to kill you than women. You are about 20 times more likely to be killed by a man than a woman. I would suggest to you that if you gauged a persons unease at meeting a white male or a black female you would see MORE unease with the male commensurate with the chance of being involved in a homicide but the sighting of a black male versus a white male should incite about 50% more unease.

Just because a person has unfavorable feelings doesn't mean that those feelings aren't in some way justified. Realizing that you know NOTHING about the men and women blacks and whites other than their sex and race. Certainly, one would like more information before creating biases against them but sometimes that is all we have.

Let's look at this in a different light so that we don't let race get involved.

If you were exposed to two different animals in which the chance that you would be killed by one is 7.5 times higher than another animal regardless of how likely that is (think sharks, lions, bears that kind of thing) would you be more wary of the animal that is 7.5 times higher kill rate than the other, all other things being equal? One would effectively be a fool not to.

Biases can arise that skew the likelihood of events happening and that is most likely happening in the homicide area. As I have stated in other threads if you leave the drugs alone and you live a "regular" type life your chances of being killed in a homicide are quite low and decreasing. But people inherently know the numbers and for the black community they are not good. I wish I could say this isn't the case but it is and you can't change that in the short term.

EDIT: The article says males are 10 times more likely but when I look at the chart it looks like 5 versus 100 which would be 20 times. 20 or 10 the concept is the same.

Posted on: 8/28 8:26 am
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Re: what is third tier rights really mean??
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
This is great for those of us who no longer live in mountaineer country.


....or those that live in the distant outpost of Pittsburgh...I am downloading the ap as we speak.

Posted on: 8/27 6:33 pm
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College Football pick'em
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Is anyone going to setup a college football pickem? I look forward to this and I can't even remember what site we used in the past.

Posted on: 8/27 3:07 pm
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Re: Media goes into full race batting mode.
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
So they act violently, riot and loot to "protest" the criminal justice system. I can't imagine why they have drawn this suspicion......


A world model that perpetuates the perception, huh?

I am missing something here. Are people on here actually accepting this behavior as an acceptable "method" of protest?

Posted on: 8/27 1:03 pm
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Re: Media goes into full race batting mode.
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
The different reaction to these stories is because one group (whites) by and large feels like the justice system by and largely works for them.


That is utter BS. There are plenty of whites that don't believe the system works for them. Ask the average poor white if he thinks the system "works" for him.

You have made a racist comment that perpetuates racism. The fact is that the "system" does NOT work for poor people. If you are wealthy and you have a fancy lawyer you can kill people, if you are poor and you kill people you get the death penalty. That is a fact backed up by study after study. See there is no reason to bring race into it. Poor people are universally fucked.....black or white.

Posted on: 8/27 11:59 am
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Re: Media goes into full race batting mode.
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
I deny that they're treating this story differently than any other big news story.


This is a big news story?! WOW! You certainly set the bar pretty low. I could think of a half dozen stories that have more national interest than looting and rioting in a town the size of Morgantown. Let's see....on a national level I would think that international news stories would be analyzed more than 163 people being arrested in riots. 163 People.....not thousands....The amount of airtime given to this podunk town in Mo is inordinate. I stand by that statement.

When the "Occupy" movement went into Wall Street did they have multi-nightly coverage of this with analysis? Nope. Why not? Because these were disillusioned young white people mostly.

Posted on: 8/27 11:56 am
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Re: Media goes into full race batting mode.
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
This story involves a killing, rioting and protesting. That's going to make the news every time whether racism is perceived or not.


That is correct. At the same time, how many lootings and riots do you think we would have without racism? It is in the best interest of the media to promote racism. See below.

Do you deny that they aren't giving this coverage above and beyond its news value? I mean there was rioting and looting for a couple of nights and for the most part the subsequent rioting was done by out-of-towners am I right about that?

If we lived in racial harmony a significant number of events would be like the Utah kid and would be a non-story. What would fill the dead air then? Racism provides a viable news story during slow news periods between plane crashes, wars and elections. There is 24 hours 7 days a week of air time that needs to be filled and there is important needs to differentiate the coverage from the "mainstream" or those filthy "conservatives/liberals"

Posted on: 8/27 11:02 am
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Re: Media goes into full race batting mode.
Makin' it Rain
Joined:
8/2/2010 10:50 am
From Canonsburg, PA
Posts: 3016
Quote:
You guys are oversimplifying this.


Not oversimplifying it at all. Racism is big money. The promotion of it or the illusion of it. It is ALL big money. I am not a person who believes that is a big conspiracy or an agenda but the fact is that Fox News and the Christian Science Monitor is reporting this story from two different points of view. One from the illusion that the whole world is against blacks the other of look at those blacks using a killing as reason to loot. I will leave it up to you to decide which is which.

The SAD fact is that Sharpton and Jackson would be nothing without the illusion.....and they have become quite wealthy....and the promotion of it makes people feel better about themselves and calls to action to protect one's self from "those" people. It is sad really, but I think this is the best it will get until racism stops being big money. The older I get the less likely I think this is.

In better news, I think that racism is probably not as bad in the US as most of the other countries I have been to.

Posted on: 8/27 10:25 am
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